End of rip offs?

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Avensist
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End of rip offs?

#1 Post by Avensist »

Is this the end of rip offs? Once those sites are sold, would they become competitive like MRH once was? Wait to be seen. Would be nice to have those LPG pumps reinstated which were removed under the MFG.
https://forecourttrader.co.uk/latest-ne ... 04.article

Brian_H
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Re: End of rip offs?

#2 Post by Brian_H »

I'd doubt you'd see any reinstated where they have already gone from their estate - Theres a few on that list that I recognise as having LPG but 87 sites isjust short of 10% of their estate. Also they have to find someone to buy them!

Trouble is, a lot of the ones they have ripped LPG out of to use the space occupied by the tanks as EV charging space.

At least its not £2 a litre like petrol is in some places at the minute! Filled up at Woodall services this afternoon, LPG 66.9p. Petrol 199.9p or 204.9p for diesel. Shell this evening near here 72.9 for LPG. 189.9 for petrol, 196.9 for diesel!

Their station locatior shows 58 sites with LPG - though a quick look at there shows a few that definitely do not have it any more.

https://www.motorfuelgroup.com/locations/undefined

Avensist
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Re: End of rip offs?

#3 Post by Avensist »

You may be right Brian.

The other day, I stopped by at Sainsbury's in London Colney where LPG pump is out of action since October last year as one of the passenger was desperate to go to the loo. I had a word with the staff and they said that the tanks need changing with certification compliance and the road needs to get dug up so they are likely not to renew. He also said that Dome roundabout in Watford have the same issue and will be removed soon.

The Dome roundabout one, went from 64.9p to 85.9p only recently so I would have thought they recognised the demand...

Gilbertd
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Re: End of rip offs?

#4 Post by Gilbertd »

The only one on the list that I recognise is A1 Wittering. That one is currently at the MFG norm of 99.9ppl Since Shell removed the LPG pump at the Peterborough services and the Applegreen station at Kate's Cabin a mile or so north of the services has had the pumps out of order for over a year now, Wittering is the first station on the northbound A1 from London (even though it is the best part of 90 miles north of London).

It does look like prices are dropping back to something like normal now the Flogas deliveries are back to normal(ish) though.
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Brian_H
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Re: End of rip offs?

#5 Post by Brian_H »

Swaffham and Bourne South are ones I recognoise as well as Wittering, though aren't ones I'd often use they are ones I drive past.

Kates Kabin has been out of order for as long as I can remember, the Applegreen at Wyboston is more often broken than working as well to the point it can't be relied on. Cornish Gateway would be the newish services area and does have LPG (or did).

A handful of the others I know have had it in the past, but no idea if they still do.

Sainsburys Colney should be in prime position to sell LPG really, theres nowhere left on the m25 now with it in working order. The local Shell did get their tanks replaced here, though it took Flogas several months to actually do that, Sainsburys did pull LPG out of most of their sites many years ago though outside of London the only one they have had for years was Taunton, I think they only have 5 sites left now, the other two being Charlton (Greenwich) and Beckton.

Avensist
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Re: End of rip offs?

#6 Post by Avensist »

99.9p is getting to MFG's norm.

The Swaffham one is out of action for a very long time, longer than Colney I think.

Colney is ideal location but somehow those at the management often make the wrong decision... History repeat itself...

LPGC
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Re: End of rip offs?

#7 Post by LPGC »

I still want to be able to buy LPG at 60p per litre, the cheaper the better...

And until relatively recently I could buy it at 60p per litre but that was when petrol was £1.25 per litre so LPG at 60p was only 48% of the price of petrol.

I now usually pay around 80p per litre, which is less than 50% of the price of petrol.

When I paid 60p per litre and petrol was £1.25 I'd expect to use around 10% more LPG than petrol so I'd adjust that 60p price to 66p, so I'd expect to save 59p per litre or around 47%.

Now when I pay 80p per litre I again adjust that to 88p and with petrol currently costing around £1.80 per litre I'm saving around the same 47% but am now saving 92p per litre instead of 59p. Or even if I paid £1 per litre for LPG I'd still be saving 70p.

My vehicle running costs have increased with the higher overall fuel prices... But I am saving more money now by running on LPG instead of running on petrol than ever before, it just doesn't feel like it because I was used to the lower overall fuel prices and hardly ever used petrol.

There is a massive difference between the lowest and highest prices of forecourt LPG. We blame the forecourts and I'm sure many of them are to blame.. But not all of them - try setting up an independent LPG station and see what prices you're quoted for supply from the big suppliers. Even if you intend on selling at marginally above the price you pay the supplier for LPG it could still be difficult to compete with some of the forecourts that seem to be charging rip-off prices. In some cases it would be more profitable to buy gas from one of the most expensive nearby forecourts to fill your own forecourt tank to sell to customers than it would be to buy gas from a supplier, even if you own your own equipment. Some of the problem is the suppliers and anti-competition practices... Don't have to read far between the lines about government monopoly control systems getting involved with supply to home heating customers to expect similar is (still) going on with supply to forecourts. A lot more new forecourts would be started up if suppliers were more open about pricing, didn't expect to sell/lease brand new equipment to startup customers and would put it in writing that they'd supply at cost they supply to some of their big customers (such as Morrisons etc) plus a percentage for not selling LPG in such high quantities. I (and I know several others) would set up LPG stations in areas short of LPG forecourts if suppliers would do that.
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Avensist
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Re: End of rip offs?

#8 Post by Avensist »

You're right Simon. Savings are still there but due to huge price difference between forecourts don't feel the confidence as a consumer.

It is also a regrettable fact about lack of competition, not just the LPG but other industries too.

Gilbertd
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Re: End of rip offs?

#9 Post by Gilbertd »

The way I look at it is this. On petrol my car averages 19.5 mpg, on LPG I get around 210 miles from a 63 litre fill, so that works out at 15.1 mpg. With LPG at 70ppl and petrol at £1.80ppl, my 210 miles will cost me £44.10 in LPG but would cost me £88.00, virtually double the cost. So I'm running a 2.5 tonne car with a 4.0 litre V8 and getting the cost equivalent of over 30mpg, not complaining about that at all.
96 Saab 900XS, AEB Leo, sold
93 Range Rover 4.2LSE, Lovato LovEco, sold
97 Range Rover 4.0SE, multipoint, sold
98 Ex-Police Range Rover 4.0, AEB Leo, daily motor
96 Range Rover 4.6HSE Ascot, AEB Leo, my spare


Proud member of the YCHJCYA2PDTHFH club.

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