Brim to brim...

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Gilbertd
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Re: Brim to brim...

#21 Post by Gilbertd » Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:31 am

Pinger wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 9:09 am
I do have an even older lap top that has a serial port that has two rows of pins. One row has 13 and the other 12.
That's a parallel port used to connect a printer in the days before USB so that won't work either.
96 Saab 900XS, AEB Leo, sold
93 Range Rover 4.2LSE, Lovato LovEco, sold
97 Range Rover 4.0SE, multipoint, sold
98 Ex-Police Range Rover 4.0, AEB Leo, daily motor
96 Range Rover 4.6HSE Ascot, AEB Leo, my spare


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Pinger
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Re: Brim to brim...

#22 Post by Pinger » Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:32 pm

No matter, I'll persevere with the USB connection - just takes a little time sometimes to display O2 and actuator activity. It hasn't totally failed me yet!

Brian_H
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Re: Brim to brim...

#23 Post by Brian_H » Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:37 pm

The 25 pin port is probabbly a DB25 serial port as long as it has pins in there and not holes. You'd use one of these to sort that. https://www.amazon.co.uk/StarTech-com-D ... 000087RYP/

It would be unusual to see a serial port that size on a laptop though, or at least one from the last 20 years or so! (even desktop pcs when serial ports were more commonly used tended to be the 9 pin versions for the most part) More likely it would be a parallel port for a printer or similar on a laptop, though its possible.

The AEB program your referring to on the mp3 player will not run on anything that isn't running windows, Its not enough to just drop the files onto it either. The only one I've used is for the KME Nevo, and has to be downloaded from the play store > https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... asic&gl=GB
There are similar for other systems
https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... bile&gl=GB
https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... oid2&gl=GB

Nothing similar exists for the older AEB 175 systems, nor is it likely to unless someone wants to develop an app to do it, As far as i know the AEB175 is not developed any more, and most of the various branded AEB 175 have run out of new stock and are not being produced anymore, the only ones available are the Bigas one now. Given they all use different versions of the same Pc software writing an app to do it would be a fair bit of work, for little to no reward (the manufacturers aren't likely to make an app as they have no reason to do so in the case of the older units, so its only likely to be someone on a hobbyist basis).

Edit - Posted the above after reading the last post on page 1 without seeing the 2 replies afterwards...

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Re: Brim to brim...

#24 Post by Pinger » Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:17 am

Brian_H wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:37 pm
The 25 pin port is probabbly a DB25 serial port as long as it has pins in there and not holes. You'd use one of these to sort that. https://www.amazon.co.uk/StarTech-com-D ... 000087RYP/

It would be unusual to see a serial port that size on a laptop though, or at least one from the last 20 years or so! (even desktop pcs when serial ports were more commonly used tended to be the 9 pin versions for the most part) More likely it would be a parallel port for a printer or similar on a laptop, though its possible.
It has holes...
Brian_H wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:37 pm

The AEB program your referring to on the mp3 player will not run on anything that isn't running windows, Its not enough to just drop the files onto it either.
So it won't run on Palm OS Garnet v5.4.7. either?
Brian_H wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:37 pm
The only one I've used is for the KME Nevo, and has to be downloaded from the play store > https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... asic&gl=GB
There are similar for other systems
https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... bile&gl=GB
https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... oid2&gl=GB
So the KME Nevo on my Android could work?
Problem with it though is the touchscreen calibration is shot. I can get it to play music but selecting the LP is by clicking on a selection two later in the list. Finding anything else is a nightmare - not what I need when I'm after something usable while driving that is safer than the lap top on the passenger seat.
Does anyone know how to recalibrate a touchscreen when the calibration targets can't even be clicked on?!!!

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Re: Brim to brim...

#25 Post by Gilbertd » Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:51 am

The Leo software will only run under Windows, nothing else. I use a very old Panasonic Toughbook running Windows 2000 that will run anything and has a 9 pin serial port too. Trying to use anything else and you are pissing in the wind.
96 Saab 900XS, AEB Leo, sold
93 Range Rover 4.2LSE, Lovato LovEco, sold
97 Range Rover 4.0SE, multipoint, sold
98 Ex-Police Range Rover 4.0, AEB Leo, daily motor
96 Range Rover 4.6HSE Ascot, AEB Leo, my spare


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Re: Brim to brim...

#26 Post by Brian_H » Fri Sep 25, 2020 11:45 am

Pinger wrote:
Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:17 am
Brian_H wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:37 pm
The 25 pin port is probabbly a DB25 serial port as long as it has pins in there and not holes. You'd use one of these to sort that. https://www.amazon.co.uk/StarTech-com-D ... 000087RYP/

It would be unusual to see a serial port that size on a laptop though, or at least one from the last 20 years or so! (even desktop pcs when serial ports were more commonly used tended to be the 9 pin versions for the most part) More likely it would be a parallel port for a printer or similar on a laptop, though its possible.
It has holes...
Brian_H wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:37 pm

The AEB program your referring to on the mp3 player will not run on anything that isn't running windows, Its not enough to just drop the files onto it either.
So it won't run on Palm OS Garnet v5.4.7. either?
Brian_H wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:37 pm
The only one I've used is for the KME Nevo, and has to be downloaded from the play store > https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... asic&gl=GB
There are similar for other systems
https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... bile&gl=GB
https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... oid2&gl=GB
So the KME Nevo on my Android could work?
Problem with it though is the touchscreen calibration is shot. I can get it to play music but selecting the LP is by clicking on a selection two later in the list. Finding anything else is a nightmare - not what I need when I'm after something usable while driving that is safer than the lap top on the passenger seat.
Does anyone know how to recalibrate a touchscreen when the calibration targets can't even be clicked on?!!!
Sounds like the touchscreen itself is broken, or you have something caught under the edge of it pressing onto it at least.
The KME app might work on your android, but only if you had a matching ecu - which you don't. Links were there to try and show you what sort of thing you'd need to have to get that to work. Its not a viable option in your case.

Holes would confirm its a parallel port for a printer or scanner. No use to you unfortunately.

You might get better luck with a laptop running an older version of windows even with the usb lead you have if you have access to one, provided the drivers for the lead are available for the version of windows on the laptop (serial version won't need drivers so will work on older windows versions withouth that being a consideration).

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Re: Brim to brim...

#27 Post by Pinger » Fri Sep 25, 2020 1:21 pm

Windows only by the looks (I hadn't deduced my Millennium was incompatible with the KME app. My Android device is just a music player then.
The XP lap to I can use here if the W7 one wont communicate - but only on the driveway with a mains extension lead as it has no battery. An option though.
I guess for a dash display that I can drive all day with, I need something like a smart phone running Windows or a small tablet or something running the same. Things I know nothing about - but can guess they are from yesteryear and the chances of finding a good one are on a par with successfully shoving hot butter up a wild cat's arse with a red hot poker.

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Re: Brim to brim...

#28 Post by Pinger » Sun Oct 04, 2020 4:46 pm

Gilbertd wrote:
Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:51 am
The Leo software will only run under Windows, nothing else.
Will it run with Windows 10?

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Re: Brim to brim...

#29 Post by Brian_H » Sun Oct 04, 2020 5:54 pm

It appears to run on windows 10, the issue may be finding drivers for your cable (less of an issue with the serial cable than the usb one if you had a real serial port). As to how well it runs, Gillbertd would have to confirm (older software tends to be a bit unstable on newer versions of Windows so will sometimes work ok, other times it will lock up or stop working)

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Re: Brim to brim...

#30 Post by Gilbertd » Sun Oct 04, 2020 7:09 pm

Never tried running it on anything later than XP and, as Brian says, drivers may well be your biggest problem. I'm running 10 on the laptop I'm using now but still have an older one running Windows 7 as half the stuff I use won't run under 10.
96 Saab 900XS, AEB Leo, sold
93 Range Rover 4.2LSE, Lovato LovEco, sold
97 Range Rover 4.0SE, multipoint, sold
98 Ex-Police Range Rover 4.0, AEB Leo, daily motor
96 Range Rover 4.6HSE Ascot, AEB Leo, my spare


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Brian_H
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Re: Brim to brim...

#31 Post by Brian_H » Sun Oct 04, 2020 7:25 pm

You might have more luck running an older os using VMware if the laptop is upto it. I've got a few XP virtual machines running software that will not work in 64-bit windows ok like that (Microcat, Ford TIS and some Renault software as well).
https://www.vmware.com/uk/products/work ... ation.html is free for personal use, so you'd just need a copy of the appropiate os to run inside it and set it up to allow access to the ports if appropiate for the software. You'd still need working drivers on the host OS though either way if its a usb lead in use. Serial based should just pass through (but a laptop with serial ports may be too old to run VMWare of course).

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Re: Brim to brim...

#32 Post by LPGC » Sun Oct 04, 2020 7:47 pm

AEB175 software will run under W10 using a USB to serial adapter, there can be minor issues with screen sizing but it will work.

There can be problems getting W10 drivers for hard wired serial ports.
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Re: Brim to brim...

#33 Post by Pinger » Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:33 pm

This is the type of cable I have is pictured at the bottom.

And what I'm looking at are secondhand tablets with smallish screens as per here >> https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?Opera ... e=headline

They all seem to run W10 - nothing earlier.
Even if they can run with AEB I'm not entirely convinced this is feasible because at least one of them there charges via a micro USB port and if that's the only USB port then no scope for connecting to AEB (I don't have faith in anything secondhand to have a decent battery so in-car charging is essential. I have seen another though that has a more conventional type charging socket).

But first things first - AEB and W10 compatibility via the type of lead I have. As you've probably guessed this stuff is entirely alien to me so if there is a need for a further driver, please please be absolutely explicit about what this entails and the possibility of.

Most of the tablets appear to have a separate (separable) keyboard or presumably, the equivalent on their touch screen. Am I correct in thinking that loading the AEB software (from a disc and external CD/DVD player) shouldn't present any difficulty?
TIA.
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Re: Brim to brim...

#34 Post by LPGC » Mon Oct 05, 2020 1:04 pm

Pinger wrote:
Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:33 pm
This is the type of cable I have:
Looks like a WTV USB to serial lead setup with WTV adapter type 1.

The separate end (adapter) is to allow fitting different ends that have different plugs to use on various LPG systems - You can buy around another 10 different ends (or buy a kit containing all the ends from the outset).

Adapter type 1 is supposed to work with AEB175's but WTV cables are not my go-to cable, last time I used a WTV type it was probably on a laptop running XP.
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Re: Brim to brim...

#35 Post by Pinger » Mon Oct 05, 2020 1:30 pm

The cable was delivered with type 1 adaptor (which I use) and a type 4 one. Both connect to what I presume is a 'serial' connector on the cable (9 pins in two rows) with LEDs that flash when in use.

Just looked at WTV's website >> https://www.lpg-kits.com/ and it seems drivers are available for download.

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Re: Brim to brim...

#36 Post by LPGC » Mon Oct 05, 2020 2:11 pm

Yes, type 1 was the most popular until around a decade ago, worked with most early AEB and most other systems. Type 4 is the more recent AEB type, type 8 is now the most common on more recent none AEB systems. The only difference between type 4 and 8 is the middle 2 (coms) wires swap position, if coms wires are wired incorrectly the cable won't work but there won't be any damage. Wouldn't want to mix up type 9 with 4 or 8 because the power wires swap polarity, mixing those up can cause damage.

I haven't checked but the drivers on the website you linked to are probably just generic for the chipset, CCY, FTDI, etc.
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Gilbertd
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Re: Brim to brim...

#37 Post by Gilbertd » Mon Oct 05, 2020 2:40 pm

This https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Panasonic-To ... 3679702571 would do you nicely if you loaded it with Win XP or 7. Better that than a Win 10 tablet (which, as you've found, may not even have a proper USB port) that is intended for use to play games and watch streaming video. Comes with 2 batteries, a car charger and even has a proper serial port too. You'd never break it either, the Toughbook series live up to their name, specs are here https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q ... ANguxaQRvK
96 Saab 900XS, AEB Leo, sold
93 Range Rover 4.2LSE, Lovato LovEco, sold
97 Range Rover 4.0SE, multipoint, sold
98 Ex-Police Range Rover 4.0, AEB Leo, daily motor
96 Range Rover 4.6HSE Ascot, AEB Leo, my spare


Proud member of the YCHJCYA2PDTHFH club.

Pinger
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Re: Brim to brim...

#38 Post by Pinger » Mon Oct 05, 2020 3:30 pm

I get what you're saying G but that's a fair chunk of a thing to locate on the dash in my line of sight - which is my aim here - to be able to scan it as easily as the speedo. (I just folded a bit of paper to 10'' screen size and there's just space on the dash for it and a chance of holding a tablet's weight). Phone size (where this idea started) would be better still - but almost all are android or apple. It is only a visual display I want. If I want to reconfigure, there's still a lap top for that.

Tablets at least are smaller and lighter even if all are running W10. Is it possible to change a tablet from W10 to either W7 or XP?
The most recent Windows I have is W8 or 8.1 and I can at least try the AEB software on it and on the driveway (240V extension) but the battery isn't good enough to be used solo. Nothing here to experiment with W10 though.

Out of interest, are ECUs still available for mixer systems and are the friendlier re newer OSs?

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Re: Brim to brim...

#39 Post by Brian_H » Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:39 pm

You'd probabbly struggle to get XP to run on a tablet, good chance even if you managed to get it installed, that there might not be any drivers for the touchscreen for XP. Windows 7 a bit better bet, but most started out on windows 8, and theres little difference between 8 and 10 really for that sort of stuff, if it works on one it would work on the other in most cases.

Swapping the ECU out whilst possible, is probabbly not a sensible way to tackle the problem of the level sender not working as well as you'd like. Several are available here > https://tinleytech.co.uk/product-catego ... l-systems/ though I've no idea if the software for any of them is better than what you've already got, I'd suspect not though most of them use the same software with some different code to work with each version of the AEB175 (its the same software underneath, just you need the version that matches what you've got fitted).

If your only looking to do it short term and the battery at least works a bit, then the laptop you've got and and inverter would be a possible option? First example that comes to hand being this
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Eono-Essential ... 732&sr=8-5

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Re: Brim to brim...

#40 Post by Gilbertd » Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:37 pm

I just sit the laptop on the floor in the passenger footwell...... The battery in my Toughbook is completely shot but I've got a car charger for it so just run it from the fag lighter socket so a cheap inverter would be another option to run what you have.

You can get brand new single point controllers but they use the same software as the older ones because it just works. Even the latest versions of the software are the same with minor changes. What you have to remember is that we are talking serial data comms, something that the computing world considers obsolete but is still used all the time in industry.
96 Saab 900XS, AEB Leo, sold
93 Range Rover 4.2LSE, Lovato LovEco, sold
97 Range Rover 4.0SE, multipoint, sold
98 Ex-Police Range Rover 4.0, AEB Leo, daily motor
96 Range Rover 4.6HSE Ascot, AEB Leo, my spare


Proud member of the YCHJCYA2PDTHFH club.

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